Tony Jones on Mark Driscoll: What came first, the thug or the theology?

Tony Jones on Mark Driscoll: What came first, the thug or the theology?

This drawing is inspired by the Ouroboros Snake... of the snake eating its own tail. 

chicken or the egg cartoon nakedpastor david hayward

What came first? The chicken or the egg? What came first? The thug or the theology? I read Tony Jones' thoughts on Mark Driscoll.

Jones has always admired Driscoll, maybe envies him a little, wants the best for him, believes he can be redeemed, and suggests that things can be restored.

What I found most interesting though is that Jones believes the problem with Driscoll is theological.

  • He titles his post is "Thoughts about Mark Driscoll"
  • He talks about the "heady" days of publishing and speaking.
  • He dismisses his disturbing personality traits by his use of the word "sure".
  • He says it isn't a moral issue (evil) but that he is passionate.
  • He says more than once that Driscoll is "extremely smart" or "brilliant".
  • He suggests that he will "see" (as in "think"?) his way out of this.
  • He writes that Driscoll has just embraced a toxic version of theology.
  • He hopes that Driscoll will turn away from this toxic theology.
  • He concludes therefore that Driscoll is not the problem, but his theology.

But my question is‚ What came first? The thug or the theology?

That is, did Driscoll become the focus of concern because of his theology? Or was it because of his behavior?

I'm concerned that Jones' post reflects the refusal of the church to understand spiritual abuse. It neglects the pathology of its abusive leaders. I don't think this is being fair to the victims or the perpetrators of spiritual abuse. People are victims of not just a bad theology, but a pathological cruelty.

I don't think Driscoll's theology made this happen. Driscoll "embraced" his toxic version of theology because it aligned with his moral compass. It fit his personality. It worked for him to achieve his goals. Then it manifested the worst in him. Then he continued to develop his toxic theology in order to make more room for his pathological behavior. Mars Hill Church too.

Jones' sentence, "It could have happened to any of us." is true, because I believe we all participate in this dynamic. Theology is our creation. It is a reflection of our drives and desires.

Then, not satisfied to only be the product of our drives and desires, it also becomes the producer of them. Theology is a vicious cycle of our desperate need to understand and control our universe.

Step into this cycle at any point and you can see that we are both the root and fruit of our theology and pathology.

And yes, it spins out of control by manifesting itself in toxic, controlling, and abusive behavior. Nothing can be done about bad theology because of free thought and speech.

But we can do something when this manifests itself in bad behavior. Cruel theology is a nuisance. Cruel behavior is unacceptable.

When Driscoll thinks bully to his people, we can say please stop. But when he actually bullies people, we can step in and say you will stop now!

I don't think this is a theological issue. I think it is a pathological one. Not just for Driscoll and Jones, but for the entire church.

If we would be healed, our theology would take care of itself. 

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1079 comments

Re McLare’s non-apology – Xnity21 2015 and Cana Initative 1, Justice for Julie 0

FYI – unlike actual denominations, there is no actual functioning governance structure in either Mars Hill or US emergent set up to deal with abuses committed by those connecterd to either entity. In the case of Mars Hill, Driscoll sits on their Board of Advisors and Accountability, thus rendeirng them his personal pawns. The US emergent leaders are even more loosely structures as they’ve have always insisted there is no leadership in place – though they promote themselves as leaders in selling their products.

Becky Garrison

Julie-

I had honestly forgotten about that. Because I wanted to push that issue and many other issues I put a large target on my back. I was shocked where how low leaders got. They even offered for Pete Rollins to mediate the situation (he was asked and agreed) and I turned it down. Pete is a close friend of the leader who went around Transform saying I was bipolar, among other things. There was no way in hell I was going to enter any discussion with any of them. At that time there were not many who were truly standing beside me. (I do not hold anger with those who did not stand at that time. It was complicated and I get it)
I realize my pic is up on here but I wish for my real name not to be used. I cannot put my family through any more hurt. I just wanted Julie to know how many of us who have been torn apart are here. I realize many may want to find the convos and history I am bringing up, but my family is still healing from the bombs emergent put in our lives. I just cannot allow them to get bombed again.

Lost Voice

Thank you to Dan Kimball. https://www.facebook.com/DanKimball For being a person of integrity and faith. For knowing when to back away from rotten fruit and for responding to my call for help all those years ago when I was shunned and stonewalled….your words of kindness and compassion stayed with me. Mark Ostreicher too! So, interesting how the ones tied in financially can’t. speak. the. truth. EVEN when it is in their face with verifiable evidence.

Julie McMahon

I have one comment.

Being familiar with the situation, I can honestly say that the only person close to telling the whole truth in the Julie M vs. Tony J situation is Julie. The emergent cult, which she was headfirst deep in from the beginning, turned on her and excommunicated her in unceremonious ways while covering up sin in their own lives. I was there when, at the original ‘Christianity’ 21, Doug Pagitt threatened to have her removed physically by the Edina Police if she would not leave.

Pagitt, Jones, McLaren, and all their cover-up cronies are all a bunch of mysogynist hypocrites. They love themselves and they hate women.

Chuck

Julie, I think that might perhaps an example of what we in the UK call “arse-covering”…

Rob Grayson

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